Included Podcast: Episode 1 #AwakeToOurselves


In this episode Bebe Oyegun-Adeoye from Talent Talks Africa ( and Roy Gluckman, the founder and CEO of Cohesion Collective set the foundation for the Included Podcast. In episode 1 Roy seeks to unpack what equality, diversity and inclusion actually mean to individuals, leaders and organisations.

They discuss “getting woke” and their shared distaste for that phrase. The two also disrupt the idea of “getting woke”as an end point, when life is a journey of being awakened to oneself. No one is ever fully “woke.” They further discuss Roy’s personal story and journey of awakening; how this young, white man found his way into inclusion work. The impacts of inclusion work on Roy’s life and how his clients engage him are also discussed.

Privilege too makes an appearance in the episode (or rather, we would hope so!). Here Roy unpacks what privilege is, but also discusses an uncomfortable truth about privilege: the fact that it is invisible to those who hold it. This transitions into a discussion on “white guilt” and the uselessness of “white guilt” as a concept. Instead, Roy positions “responsibility” over guilt.

The Included Podcast has been designed as a tool to bring the practice of inclusion into the forefront of how we do business.

Topics Discussed in this Episode

  • “Getting woke”

  • What is Equality, Diversity and Inclusion?

  • Inclusion as a skill set and a practice

  • We are always going to fail when dealing with diversity and different people. How do we build compassion for self and continue to learn and grow “in practice.”

  • How we create more spaces for more people to speak and engage

  • Invisibility of Privilege

  • Owning Privilege

  • White Guilt